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jordan

13th June 2023, 18:38
I have a Bradford's but doubt I have used it half a dozen times in 3-4 years. Maybe I should change that. For this one, a couple of entries suggested the theme and I just did a search on the Chambers app for *violin (obviously not violin) and all but one of the ring answers magically appeared.
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quixote

13th June 2023, 23:33
Well, Jordan - the 'Violin' in the title is the only thing that has still totally escaped me - and I've filled the grid.
I started baffled by most of the Ring clues, then managed to wrestle out about half of the - mostly right-hand-side - radials cold; then my 'Eureka!' moment was the only conceivable solution of 17 (Rings) that came up in the Chambers app as a very obscure synonym - that gave me a hunch, and applying the *[hunch synonym] feature in the app indeed led me, too, to a rich list of over 30 potential ring entries, with only a few having 9 or 10 letters as required for 31(Ring) 7 (Ring) -and 35 (Ring) and with a sudden insight into the last letter of 33 (Radial) and enough radial checks for 7 (Ring) I was away.
But my [hunch synonym] isn't for a 'Violin' in anything I've tried - including Mrs Bradford - unless I'm being more than usually obtuse.

Even knowing the theme, and the emerging extra-letter message, the completion around the left-hand-side remained extremely tough, for me, right up to the end, with some fiendishly complicated clueing.

This one is right up there with the very best Listener setting standards, IMHO - thank you The Ace of Hearts, for a very challenging workout and a clever, consistent construction.
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quixote

13th June 2023, 23:40
Jazzgirl - nice to see you again on here - I'm still playing when anyone will have me. x
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jazzgirl

14th June 2023, 07:44
Quixote - Good to see you are still 'playing' ;-)

I recommend you look at Jack Aubrey's post 85 and all will fall into place.
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adeano

14th June 2023, 22:44
Done! Needed help for 27.

My first solve was 17 (ring), which gave me the nature of the ring clues immediately . Guessed the inner wheel with about half the letters, and lo and behold, that gave me the entire message! So then just had to fill it in, with the final few taking quite a while.

Followed Jack Aubrey’s instructions and still none the wiser about the title though…

Thanks Ace of Hearts
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kitsune

15th June 2023, 11:59
Enjoyed that and thank you, Ace of Hearts. My only question is whether the extra letter to be removed from radial clue 24 is correct?

I am assuming that a letter is removed from the third word but this letter leads to an incorrect spelling in the definition that is supposed to be revealed by the radial clues.

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drxx

15th June 2023, 12:13
No, the extra letter is in the first word.
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kitsune

15th June 2023, 12:18
Thank you, drxx, I was reading the clue a different way but I see your reading of it now.
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mooncow

18th June 2023, 12:39
A very nice puzzle this, which I enjoyed a lot. Like others, I'm still struggling to understand the title, despite reading the various hints people have made. When I google the title and the middle ring I just find out about musical experiments with goat-grown silk, which is interesting but doesn't seem to be quite the thing.
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mooncow

18th June 2023, 12:47
As for the erratic entry of radial answers, when cells in circular grids straddle two or three or four spots, like the inner cells here, I've always assumed that they are to be treated as if subdivided into 2, 3 or 4 individual cells all containing the same letter. I've never seen it explicitly stated though. In most circular grids the path, at least from the outside in, is unique in any case, but the offsets and irregular sizes in this grid mean there are sometimes some possible alternative paths -- I think if you were to take anything other than the direct radial route then the preamble would say so, as in the hexagonal one a few weeks ago. But it raises some interesting possibilities. Maybe someone will do a radial grid like that at some point.

Now, the REALLY important question: when doing a circular grid like this, how do people write in the answer letters? Do you write the letters with their bottoms toward the centre and their tops towards the edge, so that when looking at the whole grid the letters in radial 1 are the right way up, the letters in radial 17 are upside down, and the letters in radial 9 are sideways on? This would have the advantage that each letter fits neatly into its cell, but makes the grid hard to read and you have to keep turning it around to write. Or do you write the letters resolutely "the right way up" on the page as a whole, which makes the grid easier to read but means that the letters don't always fit very neatly into their cells, and some, like R and K and Y written into diagonally-oriented radials, are quite awkward?
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