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Malone

Thanks for the clues. Is the first 9 letters? - chantress ?

Second - who refers to the cleaner as "woman" - char, charwoman etc? When I was a cleaner, that was what I was called, which was fine. I didn't think about it at the time, but perhaps cleaneress or cleanress would have been better. I think I prefer the latter.

Grunger

Thank - and sorry about giving the wrong count for the first clue. I knew you'd get it anyway, it's probably a word you use regularly?

The definition in Chambers makes 'woman', domestic help, perfectly valid - but it's so anachronistic, I would have avoided using it.

grunger

I think I prefer simply cleaner, male or female.

Malone

I have sung in church, but have never used chantress. It reminds me of enchantress, another word I avoid.

Re woman - in my opinion, because a word is defined in dictionaries, this does not make the use acceptable. I suppose it is OK in crosswords though.

Grunger

I'm so used to 'chanter' meaning a thing (in bagpipes, the pipe with fingerholes, on which the melody is played), that 'chantress' looked distinctly odd!

Yes, woman= cleaner, domestic help would never be acceptable in the real world. It's OK, but just OK, in crosswords. And I suppose it gave the much-loved char and daily a day off?

My goodness, WOMAN for "cleaner" is completely unacceptable nowadays, and I speak as a man!

I would also claim "cook"!

Grunger/Malone

Isn't CANTRESS an eight-letter solution, the feminine of CANTOR, a male singer?

Mmm - I'm not an expert in Jewish religion, but I think that women aren't even allowed on the ground floor in their temples (is that the right word)?, so a female cantor seems rather unlikely?

...synagogues...

...and I may be confusing them with mosques. Shut up now!