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elle

2nd September 2017, 19:27
Good evening, Rusty!
I knew the meaning of "hirpling" only because you have used the word previously!
I didn't have a problem with 14d......
To me, "grounds" means "reason" ie cause ?
No need to make it plural?
But to be on the safe side, I have just checked it out in Anne B's dictionary and for reason , she gives ground (s)!
I cannot parse 8d?
I have "shepherd" = seen with crook?
and 15a: Byrd ?
We are having spaghetti bolognese for dinner....it should be just about ready.........
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rusty

2nd September 2017, 19:42
Hello, Elle.
To me a reason is a ground.
Reasons would be grounds.
But, I am no expert in English!
8, Here goes! A Leicester in this case is a breed of sheep.
Shepherds, like Farmer Hoggett in Babe, use long sticks with a curly end called "crooks". That is as close as I can get to parsing it.
15 is straightforward.
"Uninspiringly" the setter has "dry" for, reverse it.
"b" for "bowled" in cricket.
The scorer is Byrd, who wrote music/scored.
Funnily enough, I had shepherds pie for my tea!
I was hoping to see Naomi Osaka at the tennis, but her game is not on.
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malone

2nd September 2017, 19:52
Rusty, I can see why you feel 'grounds = reason' is a bit iffy, but it didn't bother me much. People used to say that adultery was grounds for divorce, and that was always in the plural. It's maybe a more common usage than you'd expect.
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rusty

2nd September 2017, 20:18
Hello, Malone!
I think it is in common usage right enough, as you say.
It just does not seem correct to me.
But, my education was fairly limited.
And, it's only a crossword, not to be taken seriously.
And I know nothing about adultery!
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chrise

2nd September 2017, 20:24
Your objection to "grounds" = "reason" is perfectly logical, rusty ....however I've never seen "ground" rather than "grounds" is this context (no, I can't explain it!)
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elle

2nd September 2017, 20:38
Hi, Rusty!
Oops!
And there was I thinking that "Byrd" was a cricketer!
I was thinking of Jackson Byrd, who I think is a fast bowler?
I find this clue confusing!
But on the whole, I thought it a good crossword
Now, do you remember, quite a long time ago now, Doglet telling us all about "swan -upping - a procedure taking place on the River Thames, where the swans are caught, tagged and then released?
I was reading yesterday about a five-year old girl who wrote to Queen Elizabeth, asking if she might "borrow" one of the Queen's swans just for the weekend.
(She thought the Queen owned all the swans in her kingdom)
She was planning to keep it in her bath.......and promised to look after it very carefully.
The story goes that the Queen got one of her aides to write to the child and explain that she couldn't provide a swan, but instead sent her a book about swan-upping!
The little girl was thrilled by the response.
A nice little story!



Chris,
As I mentioned earlier, Anne Bradford has "reason = ground(s)" in her famous dictionary!
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rusty

2nd September 2017, 21:31
Hello, Elle!
That was very nice of the Queen sending the wee girl a book!
I think Jazzgirl told us a bit about swan upping to.
If you see "scorer" in a clue, Elle, there is a great chance the setter means a composer.
Someone who writes scores.
Wonder why "score" is a piece of music?
Now, Chris and Malone, I do accept that grounds (plural) can mean reason (singular).
It is in common use.
But, in Chambers, under "ground" there is "sufficient reason".
And under the plural "grounds" there is no "reason", although there is "basis of justification" which sounds like reason, to me.
And, as Elle has pointed out, Anne Bradford has "ground(s)" under "reason".
I wonder what her thinking is?
Anyway it was a good puzzle and there is nothing wrong with a debate!
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malone

2nd September 2017, 21:53
Thanks for the research, Rusty - and I like the 'grounds = basis of justification' , which seems to indicate 'reason'... which has us going in a loop. I quite enjoy some of the quirks of the English language, and crosswords remind us of them now and again.
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rusty

2nd September 2017, 21:59
Hello, Malone!
I love the English language, and exploring it.
Yes, crossword puzzles are great for sending us delving into meanings of words etc and providing entertainment.
I know I can be a bit pernickety about parsing etc but I like things to be just so!
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malone

2nd September 2017, 22:02
Thanks, Rusty. I always have one slight quibble with Bradford's - which I think is wonderful - as it provides lists/definitions and items fall into categories ('bats', say), but we never know why some of the items are included. They've obviously appeared in various crosswords, but I'm sometimes curious to know more.
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