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meursault

25th September 2018, 16:35
Hi Cass, the 9th item is event, from 41D.
After making the column movements, row 7 is jumbled, however row 8 is not. So I assume that row 8 is to be highlighted. As for 27D, I'm aware of the region surrounding Chamonix, I know it quite well, but I'm unaware of a Spanish connection.
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ebenezer

25th September 2018, 16:49
Many thanks, djawhufc and Smartie. I dom’t think I would have got that. In fact I know I wouldn’t because I had tried and failed the same process. Not enough latitude in my thought!
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rrrobbo

25th September 2018, 17:45
Thanks as ever for all the input here. I had the grid and the event before I came here to check and complete a couple of missing down extras. The additional end game then became clear at which point I snipped away at my sole print version and then regretted checking which columns need not move. Why do I spend hours doing these and not spend minutes making copies or putting in a worksheet? So, I worked out where the answers were again, found the static ones, found the pact and still had duplicate options for 2 or 3 letters. Did anybody else? Is there a conflict resolution I missed? Doesn’t really matter as I don’t submit, but was curious. Clever puzzle and would have been astonishing if the final grid was still all real words. Really, could such be possible? Did anybody solve listeners before the internet? If so, were they always this complex? I can’t imagine ploughing through encyclopaedia Britannia
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cerasus

25th September 2018, 17:59
bump ^
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cass

25th September 2018, 18:01
Thanks so much Meursault. I had queried that word amongst my "scribblings", I will have to pay more attention in future!

Amadeo of Savoy (apparently) eventually became king following the event (Wikipedia). We live and learn....

Many thanks once more.
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meursault

25th September 2018, 18:53
You're welcome, Cass. Indeed, learning is continuous. Gathering wisdom may be more sporadic...

rrRobbo, you may regret asking questions with so much scope...
I didn't do the Blue Peter stuff (I don't send in my solutions either), but I used just 4 lines of another piece of paper to indicate the deconstruction of row 7 and reconstruction of row 8, the required contents in row 1, and the old column numbers. I think the sequence of solving makes a difference. Dealing with all the unrepeated letters of row 8 first, then the letters occurring twice. When I reached an ambiguity, I bypassed it and returned at the end. There was only one ambiguity.

Your point about the final grid not being all real words is well made. And it prevents me from joining all those who declare the puzzle 'amazing'. If a setter starts with the plan of re-arranging letters of one column in another column, and can make an initial grid with real words, then I'd say that is quite good. And in fairness the solving was enjoyable. But I'm not dazzled by the achievement. If the setter had somehow come up with a final grid of real words, I would certainly have joined the hordes offering platitudes.

As to pre-internet Listeners, what little I can remember, is that they usually didn't extend beyond a knowledge of writers and poets. In the 1990s I don't recall ever needing any other source than TCD, ODQ and perhaps a few other standard references such as Atlas, Dictionary of Music etc...
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hearing

25th September 2018, 20:27
Well this is one of the first listeners I have tried, and with the help of a few nudges from here got to the end (luckily others had asked the same things I wished To know). i am not sure I fully get 3d cryptic bit even though it was explained in an earlier post, but the straight bit was pretty clear. A few others I also got retrospectively. It was fun and I thought the end was pretty impressive, even without real words (would that even be possible?)
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meursault

25th September 2018, 20:38
Hi Hearing. TA followed by I TURN, enclosed by CLY.
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hearing

25th September 2018, 20:58
Ta indeed. Cly is a new word to me. Thanks meursalt
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bazotto

26th September 2018, 13:23
So near and yet so far. Have worked out what to move, and how and where but need some unfinished business, 1st letter of 23ac, 3rd letter of 9dn, and the crossing of 20dn with 44ac - I or Y? Belated thanks Meersault for your help with completing my last effort but I've been laid up with something only usually found on tropical trees of at least 200 years of age but now returned to the land of the solving. I agree wholeheartedly that real words after surgery would have been helpful but maybe Cagey wasn't in a helpful frame of mind. Incidentally I was woken up by a man from DHL the other morning to deliver a rolled gold biro courtesy of the Sunday Times crossword. Very nice but now I feel obliged to buy the matching pencil and fountain pen. A very expensive crossword.
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